The Seven Visions Project

Watch the Prophetic Mirror of the Last Days here: fascinating alignments in a literal view of Bible Prophecy.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

The Rapture According to Scripture

When you line up the direct statements of Jesus, Paul, and John, a complete and unified picture of the Rapture emerges:

1. The Timing of the Rapture: Living saints are caught up immediately after the dead in Christ are raised.

"And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds..."
— 1 Thessalonians 4:16–17

2. The Resurrection is "The First": Scripture labels this event as the "first resurrection," leaving no biblical basis for an earlier resurrection of believers.

"This is the first resurrection. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished."
— Revelation 20:5

3. The First Resurrection Includes Tribulation Martyrs: Those executed during the Tribulation are included in this first resurrection, placing the event after the Tribulation.

"Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus... and they lived and reigned with Christ... Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection."
— Revelation 20:4, 6

4. Jesus Placed the Resurrection on "The Last Day": Jesus taught that He Himself will raise up all believers on the last day.

"For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day."
— John 6:40

5. Instant Transformation of Living Saints: Living believers are transformed from mortal to immortal bodies instantaneously, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye.

"We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye... the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."
— 1 Corinthians 15:51–52

6. The Location of the Gathering: Both the resurrected and transformed living saints rise into the clouds to meet Jesus in the air as He descends.

"...caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air."
— 1 Thessalonians 4:17

7. Accompanying Audible Signals: The gathering occurs with a shout, the voice of an archangel, and the trumpet of God.

"For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God."
— 1 Thessalonians 4:16

8. The "Last Trumpet": Paul specifically states this happens at the "last trumpet"; the same seventh and final trumpet where the dead are judged and rewarded.

"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound..."
— 1 Corinthians 15:52

"And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints..."
— Revelation 11:15–18

9. Post-Tribulation Timing: Jesus taught that the gathering of the elect happens immediately after the tribulation of those days when He appears in the clouds.

"Immediately after the tribulation of those days... they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."
— Matthew 24:29–30

10. Angelic Gathering: Jesus taught that He will send His angels with a trumpet sound to gather His elect.

"And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds..." — Matthew 24:31

*Every point above is anchored directly in clear, explicit Scripture.
If you hold a different view on the timing or description of these events, which specific scripture text contradicts any of these ten statements?

#BibleProphecy #Rapture #PreTrib

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

Summarizing the Last Day

​Jesus explicitly defines the "Last Day" as the day of resurrection (John 6:39–40).

Harmonizing Scripture reveals it is the single, pivotal day that closes the current age—the final day of man's rule and the end of grace before judgment falls.

It is the thief in the night that comes on an unsuspecting world.

​It serves as the precise dividing line in end-times prophecy

​After the Tribulation:
The cosmic signs and gathering occur "immediately after the tribulation" (Matt 24:29–31).

​Before the Wrath:
Those same cosmic signs occur "before the great and awesome day of the Lord" (Joel 2:31).

Events of the Last Day:
The Last Day unfolds in order throughout the day, beginning precisely 3.5 days after the two witnesses are killed:

1. ​The Two Witnesses Rise: The two witnesses are resurrected and caught up to heaven in a cloud (Rev 11:11–12).

2. ​​A Great Earthquake: A massive earthquake strikes, with Revelation detailing its immediate impact in Jerusalem—destroying a tenth of the city and killing 7,000 people (Rev 11:13).

3. The Seventh Trumpet Sounds: The final trumpet blows, declaring that the kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of Christ and ending the mystery of God (Rev 10:7, 11:15).

4. Cosmic Darkness & Heaven Opens: The sun turns dark, the moon turns to blood, and the sky recedes as heaven opens (Joel 2:31, Rev 6:12–14).

5. The Second Coming & Resurrection: Christ appears visibly, the dead in Christ are raised, the elect are gathered from across the earth, and the wrath of God begins (Matt 24:29–31, 1 Thess 4:16–17).

​The Four Stages of the End

​1. The Tribulation: The period of trial and persecution preceding Christ's return (Matt 24:21).

​2. The Last Day: The pivotal day marked by the Sixth Seal and Seventh Trumpet—where Christ appears, the dead are raised, and the elect are gathered (Matt 24:29–31, Rev 6:12–17).

​3. The Wrath of God: The execution of divine wrath upon the unrepentant world through the bowl judgments (Rev 15:1, 16:1).

​4. The Kingdom: The physical establishment of Christ's reign on Earth (Rev 11:15, 20:4).

When Scripture defines the Last Day, the timeline flows in a clear, natural order:

​Tribulation > Last Day > Wrath > Kingdom

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

The Mystery of the Last Day

When is the Last Day according to Jesus?​
This overlooked phrase is the anchor to all end-time prophecy. ​

1. The Last Day: Resurrection Day
Jesus anchors the resurrection to the last day, referring to the literal, final day of the current age.
Scripture directly links that resurrection to the moment He returns.

Jesus defines the Last Day:
"…everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day" (John 6:40).

Daniel is promised to rise at the end:
"But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and arise to your inheritance at the end of the days" (Dan 12:13).

Paul outlines the order:
"But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming" (1 Cor 15:23). ​

2. The Second Coming: In the Clouds
Scripture establishes the exact, literal, and visible manner of Jesus’ return as an arrival in the clouds.

The pattern of Christ's physical return:
"…while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight… 'This same Jesus… will so come in like manner as you saw Him go into heaven'" (Acts 1:9, 11).

John declares the visible return:
"Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him…" (Rev 1:7).

3. The Resurrection: At His Return
The resurrection occurs at the exact moment of His return. When He appears in the clouds, the saints are gathered to Him.

Jesus describes the gathering:
"…they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven… and He will send His angels… and they will gather together His elect…" (Matt 24:30–31).

Caught up in the clouds:
"For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven… and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive… shall be caught up together with them in the clouds…" (1 Thess 4:16–17).

The harvest of the earth:
"…behold, a white cloud, and on the cloud sat One like the Son of Man… and He who sat on the cloud thrust in His sickle on the earth, and the earth was reaped" (Rev 14:14, 16).

4. The Cloud Arrival: Claiming the Kingdom
The arrival on the clouds is also the exact moment Christ receives authority and shares the Kingdom with the saints.

The Son of Man given the Kingdom:
"I was watching in the night visions, and behold, One like the Son of Man, coming with the clouds of heaven! … Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom…" (Dan 7:13–14).

The Saints inherit the Kingdom:
"Until the Ancient of Days came… and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom" (Dan 7:22).

The Last Day marks the exact moment Jesus returns in the clouds, the dead in Christ are raised, and the kingdom is transferred.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

The Sixth Seal and the Last Day

How does the Sixth Seal connect to the Last Day?
While Revelation 6 highlights the cosmic signs and the terror of the world, key clues within the text—and parallel descriptions in the Gospels—reveal that this seal marks the return of Christ, the resurrection, and the beginning of wrath.

1. ​The Return of Christ at the Sixth Seal

The Timeline Must Match:
Because Revelation 6 and Matthew 24 share the exact same cosmic sequence, they are describing the exact same event—tying Christ's return directly to the Sixth Seal.

​The Return is Visibly Public:
Jesus explicitly states that "then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven... and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds" (Matt 24:30), showing that His coming is an undeniable, visible event.

​The Power of His Coming:
By declaring that people will see the Son of Man "sitting at the right hand of Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven" (Matt 26:64), Jesus links His heavenly authority directly to the moment of His coming.

​The Panic Confirms the Scene:
The frantic terror of the rulers in Revelation 6 trying to hide "from the face of Him who sits on the throne" is the direct human response to this sudden, visible revelation in the heavens.

2. The Gathering of the Saints at the Sixth Seal

A Direct Sequence:
Matthew 24 places the gathering of the elect immediately after the 6th Seal cosmic signs and visible return in the clouds.

​Gathering Angels:
They are sent specifically with a great trumpet sound to collect the saints from one end of heaven to the other.

​The Harvest from the Cloud:
Again we refer to Revelation 14, where One like the Son of Man sits upon a cloud to reap the earth—reinforcing that His arrival on the clouds is the explicit moment the saints are harvested from the earth.

3. The Wrath of God and the Unveiling of Heaven

The Prophetic Timeline:
Joel explicitly establishes that the cosmic signs occur before the coming of the great and awesome Day of the Lord, proving His wrath follows the signs.

​Confirmed by Hostile Witnesses:
In Revelation 6, the panicked rulers and kings hide in the rocks, openly declaring that "the great day of His wrath has come"—a confession from Christ's enemies that His physical appearance marks the arrival of judgment.

​The Thief in the Night:
Scripture describes both Christ's return (Revelation 16:15) and the Day of the Lord (1 Thess 5:2) as arriving like a "thief in the night."

While those in darkness are caught off guard and driven to hide in caves, believers are not in darkness for this day to overtake them as a thief (1 Thess 5:4).

The Sky Rolled Back:
The Sixth Seal describes the sky receding like a scroll rolling up (Rev 6:14), providing an earthly view of heaven as Christ emerges for the gathering of the elect (Rev 19:11) and the outpouring of the bowls of wrath (Rev 15:5).

The cosmic signs of the Sixth Seal announce Christ's visible return to gather the elect, while initiating the Day of the Lord's wrath upon the unprepared world.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

@RobotSynergy It's amazing how many direct Bible passages people are willing to casually dismiss to support an unbiblical doctrine.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

@Joel7Richardson Bad memories Joel lol

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

@DeborahLeeButl1 It's actually getting a lot easier to imagine it. I live in Canada lol

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

Silence in Heaven
The Heavenly Conditions Behind the Wrath of God, or Just a Pause?

1. Wrath Is Expected (The 6th Seal Setup)
The 6th Seal ends with everyone on earth panicking and declaring that the Day of Wrath has arrived. So when the 7th Seal opens next, we should expect the wrath to begin immediately, not just a pause.

​"...'Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?'"
— Revelation 6:16–17

2. The Silence of the Wrath in the Old Testament
Throughout Old Testament prophecy, silence in God's presence signals that He is rising from His heavenly throne to execute judgment.

​"Be silent in the presence of the Lord God; for the day of the Lord is at hand..."
— Zephaniah 1:7

​"Be silent, all flesh, before the Lord, for He is aroused from His holy habitation!"
— Zechariah 2:13

3. God's Wrath Is Declared After the Seventh Trumpet
The 7th Trumpet specifically announces that God's wrath has finally arrived. Therefore, the trumpets themselves are not God's Wrath; they are warning judgments upon a rebellious world leading up to it.

​"Then the seventh angel sounded... 'The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come...'"
— Revelation 11:15, 18

4. When Silence Falls in the Heavenly Throne Room
In Revelation 15, all heavenly praise and worship ceases while the bowls of wrath are poured out. Because no one is allowed to enter the temple during this time, the throne room is cleared out, leaving only a deafening silence.

​"The temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God... and no one was able to enter the temple till the seven plagues of the seven angels were completed."
— Revelation 15:8

5. The Trumpets Cannot Be Contained Within the Seventh Seal
Both the 6th Seal and 7th Trumpet mark the same moment, dividing the tribulation from God's wrath.

a) ​Ending the Tribulation: The 6th Seal marks the end of tribulation via cosmic darkness (Matt. 24:29), while the 7th Trumpet marks the end of the 1,260-day tribulation period (Rev. 11:14–15).

b) ​Resurrection & Return: The 6th Seal aligns with Christ’s return and gathering of the elect (Matt. 24:30–31), while the 7th Trumpet brings the resurrection, reward of the saints, and Christ taking His kingdom (Rev. 11:15–18).

c) Beginning the Wrath: The 6th Seal declares "the great day of His wrath has come" (Rev. 6:17), while the 7th Trumpet explicitly announces "Your wrath has come" (Rev. 11:18).

Far from being a simple pause, the silence in heaven reflects the profound stillness of the throne room as the full wrath of God unfolds.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

12 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

Does the "and" there make this verse subordinate to the 7th trumpet? We must be consistent.

Many visions throughout Revelation begin with "and".

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

@DeborahLeeButl1 Yes I agree with that. Most people seem to see the trumpets as wrath, but the beast won't have authority or persecute the saints when His wrath is poured out.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

I'm simply showing you another way of looking at it which also aligns with Scripture. It may not align with your view of scripture and if your not interested in any other views, that's not a problem.

The text I referred to is Jesus' statements in Matthew 24, and Joel 2. I didn't think you needed a direct quote or references.

Jesus said the sun and moon would be darkened immediately after the tribulation. Therefore a reasonable conclusion is that the tribulation ends at the 6th seal.

He also stated that next He would be seen coming in the clouds. And then the elect would be gathered.

Joel tells us that the sun and moon are darkened before the day of the Lord, which is God's wrath. That gives us tribulation > darkness > coming > wrath.

The people hiding confirm that His wrath has come. And they clearly see "the face of Him who sits on the throne"

The trumpets run parallel to the two witnesses for 1260 days. That is the tribulation. The Gentile nations are occupying or trampling Jerusalem and the witnesses are prophesying. The 7th trumpet uses words to suggest the resurrection and coming. The kingdom is transferred, its the time of the dead and rewards. Jesus said His reward is with Him, so if it's time for rewards, then it's time for His coming. Then the wrath follows.
The trumpets follow the same patern as the seals, just replace the darkness with the trumpet. They both represent the coming and resurrection.

There's no problem with the 1/3 of the sun darkening and other judgments. These happen throughout the 3.5 years. The 6th seal darkness lines up with the 7th trumpet to end the tribulation and begin the wrath. The earlier seals and trumpets are not the same events but they take place inside the tribulation before the day of the Lord begins at the 6th seal and 7th trumpet.

My purpose is not to convince you, I'm just sharing my views and how I got there. If you are confident in your views, hold on to them because it's awesome to have that level of understanding.

I'm still working on mine.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

Yes of course. That is the common interpretation. It could be both.

The reason I hesitate with seeing just angels is because the stars go dark and fall. So whatever John and the other prophets saw, looked like meteor showers but probably much more. This must have been something that looked much bigger.

And if the stars are angels falling, is there a spiritual explanation for the sun and moon going dark?

It's not just a solar eclipse. The OT speaks of "a day of clouds and thick darkness." Maybe it's just a massive thick cloud cover over all the earth? But the stars don't just go dark, they fall.
So much to consider.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

The Rapture According to Scripture

When you line up the direct statements of Jesus, Paul, and John, a complete and unified picture of the Rapture emerges:

1. The Timing of the Rapture: Living saints are caught up immediately after the dead in Christ are raised.

"And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds..."
— 1 Thessalonians 4:16–17

2. The Resurrection is "The First": Scripture labels this event as the "first resurrection," leaving no biblical basis for an earlier resurrection of believers.

"This is the first resurrection. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished."
— Revelation 20:5

3. The First Resurrection Includes Tribulation Martyrs: Those executed during the Tribulation are included in this first resurrection, placing the event after the Tribulation.

"Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus... and they lived and reigned with Christ... Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection."
— Revelation 20:4, 6

4. Jesus Placed the Resurrection on "The Last Day": Jesus taught that He Himself will raise up all believers on the last day.

"For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day."
— John 6:40

5. Instant Transformation of Living Saints: Living believers are transformed from mortal to immortal bodies instantaneously, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye.

"We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye... the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."
— 1 Corinthians 15:51–52

6. The Location of the Gathering: Both the resurrected and transformed living saints rise into the clouds to meet Jesus in the air as He descends.

"...caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air."
— 1 Thessalonians 4:17

7. Accompanying Audible Signals: The gathering occurs with a shout, the voice of an archangel, and the trumpet of God.

"For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God."
— 1 Thessalonians 4:16

8. The "Last Trumpet": Paul specifically states this happens at the "last trumpet"; the same seventh and final trumpet where the dead are judged and rewarded.

"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound..."
— 1 Corinthians 15:52

"And the time of the dead, that they should be judged,
And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints..."
— Revelation 11:15–18

9. Post-Tribulation Timing: Jesus taught that the gathering of the elect happens immediately after the tribulation of those days when He appears in the clouds.

"Immediately after the tribulation of those days... they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."
— Matthew 24:29–30

10. Angelic Gathering: Jesus taught that He will send His angels with a trumpet sound to gather His elect.

"And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds..." — Matthew 24:31

*Every point above is anchored directly in clear, explicit Scripture.
If you hold a different view on the timing or description of these events, which specific scripture text contradicts any of these ten statements?

#BibleProphecy #Rapture #PreTrib

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

I didn't expect you to see what I was showing you and I understand where you're coming from.

I see nothing wrong with analyzing any passages individually, before harmonizing it with others.

I only made that distinction for you because you can't see that the trumpets start a new vision. But they can. I'm not saying they must, just that they can. And other texts support it. I simply removed the 144,000 narrative to allow you to see the entire seals narrative as a whole. And the trumpets as a whole.

But ignoring the structure laid out by Jesus and Joel makes a bigger difference.

They establish a timeline...

Tribulation > Darkness > Coming > Resurrection

The seals fit that pattern
The trumpets fit that pattern

The tribulation ends at the 6th seal according to Jesus but there's another 3.5 years if the trumpets continue from there.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

Anything is possible. We know the martyrs will reign with Christ. And a remnant of Israel will be nourished in the wilderness, presumably for the kingdom.

It seems to make sense that the 144,000 have that same roll. I really don't know any other reason why God would protect them from harm. He's not going to protect the church. There will be massive amounts of martyrs and this flesh has very little value, other than serving Him on this earth. But how much better to live with Him for eternity!

It's always interesting to contemplate.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

I've heard that theory a couple times. While we won't know till it happens I generally reject the premise because it involves changing physics. It could easily be clouds, smoke, ash.

The other trumpets don't seem to permanently change the planet. The poisoned waters won't last forever, maybe only a few days or weeks. These could all be the results of wars or casual disasters.

Maybe they will be like the judgments on Egypt, or maybe they are just the effects of other disasters. But your guess is as good as mine.

I presume literal stars won't fall to earth at the 6th seal either. Probably meteors.
I do have a fun theory on that though.

There will be no need for communication or spy satellites in the Kingdom, so I think John saw all those satellites and space junk crashing to Earth.

God stopped the efforts of Babel from "reaching to the heavens", our communication has gone far beyond a single language. The pride of men is reaching the heavens, a presence in space and the ultimate communication using satellites.

I can't imagine Jesus reigning in Jerusalem and 100's of thousands of Man made objects are still orbiting the earth, and falling randomly out of orbit.

I can't wait to see it all in action!

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

You may not agree with what I'm doing here, but this is simply an exercise to demonstrate how it looks if you analyze each vision independently.

Since chapter and verses were added much later by publishers, we can group the verses by vision for this example.

Chapter 6 - The Scroll with Seven Seals

15 Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slave and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains,
16 calling to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb,
17 for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?”
18 When the Lamb opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour.

Chapter 8 - Seven Angels with Seven Trumpets

1 Then I saw the seven angels who stand before God, and seven trumpets were given to them.
2 And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer, and he was given much incense to offer with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne.

By looking at the seals and trumpets grouped this way, you can see how the seventh seal could potentially be ending the first vision, and the trumpets could simply be beginning a new one.

Just another perspective to consider if you're interested.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

I understand with much of what you're saying, and I agree with some of it. I used to have a similar approach when I was pre-trib, but I took a step back to see if the literal words could be harmonized into a coherent narrative, and I'm much more comfortable with what I have come to.

I don't like to spiritualize more than necessary.

With the 144,000, many opinions interpret them without good cause. You have 144,000 Jehovah's Witnesses, and 144,000 Christian evangelist, and there are other claims. I believe literally what the Bible says and the rest I will leave as unknown. It says they are 12,000 from each tribe and they are male virgins.

My theory is that they are preserved physically to repopulate the kingdom and to fulfill the kingdom promises by including all 12 tribes. If God is going to do this, it makes sense that they aren't defiled with women, and why else give us that information? Why preserve them physically when they can simply be resurrected to live forever. They will be the seed that lives on into the Millennium. But it's just a theory. So far I don't see a better one.

I used to think it was weird to have 2 men dressed in sacloth calling down fire from heaven, but who are we to say? That's what it says. Maybe it won't happen exactly as we think but if we don't accept the literal words, you can say they're the church, I can say they are invisible angels or whatever I feel like.

Hope that makes sense. There are many things we'll probably never figure out, but it's important to stick to what it tells us so that we don't go too far off with new theories. I think I started doing this because I don't think we should be able to have 100's of opposing views from the same Bible. I'd like to see us all agree and be on the same page. I'm an optimist lol.

Based on that you'll see me having some unorthodox ideas but I feel like they are as good as anyone else's and I like that I can reconcile them with the literal text. And I'm always open to being shown where I may be wrong.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

I don't believe the seals, trumpets and bowls repeat the same 7 events. The bowls absolutely follow the trumpets, and nothing else but the 7 Bowls are labeled as the wrath of God. The numbering forces 1-7 in that order, three separate times. They are not labeled 1-21.

The fourth horse is given power over a fourth of the earth. That can be a geographic area, it's not the same as destroying a third of the sea etc.

The 1/3 judgments are in the 3.5 year tribulation, then the 100% judgments follow with the bowls. That's logical.

Those facts don't prevent the seals and trumpets from being different perspectives of the same tribulation period. Yes the written order is compelling, but if each vision is studied independently, they can have overlap.

The only difference is in our approach. Both ways have potential setbacks, so I consider what fits best.

I'm looking for clues that suggest the actual order rather than just the written order. Revelation 12-13 proves that the vision can go back for a different angle.

Jesus said the darkeness comes immediately after the tribulation. That alone makes the 6th seal the end of the tribulation.

The Resurrection isn't actually placed in Rev 20. It is explaining the role of the resurrected martyrs and telling us that they were resurrected at the first resurrection. We conclude that it takes place after the tribulation because it includes tribulation martyrs.

If the tribulation ends at the 6th seal then there's no reason why the resurrection can't happen at that time, in line with the gathering of the saints in Matthew 24.

I also have a problem with Joel and the people hiding, declaring that the wrath begins after the darkness, but then it doesn't actually begin until 3.5 years later.

I see 7 times when the narration goes past the tribulation and then returns back to the tribulation. To me that is likely a sign that they are individual, angles. You may not agree but you may want to at least consider it. But if you're 100% in your view, that's okay too.

What we believe won't make it happen that way. We will find out when it does. But it's good to consider every option. I used to follow the same basic outline as you, but now I find less contradiction with the literal words.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

I'm trying to understand.

The 6th seal war is against the church?

The two witnesses represent the church?

Then the resurrection is when the two witnesses rise just before the 7th trumpet sounds?

Personally, I always thought that the mystery of God is finished at that time because the whole world witnesses the two witness rise and ascend, and then the great earthquake follows, and it says they were afraid and gave glory to the God of heaven.

Hard not to believe in God after witnessing that.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

The issue seems to be the perceived chronology and timeline of Revelation.

There is clearly some overlap, the difference is which parts we accept as overlap, or parallel visions.

Do you see chapter 13 as parallel to the trumpets and is that the only overlap?

I also see the wrath being declared twice as an indication that there is also overlap between the seals and trumpets.

If the 6th seal declares the wrath and the trumpets follow, then the wrath is declared again at the 7th trumpet, what about the first 6 trumpets? Are they also wrath?

If you don't accept that the wrath begins at the 6th seal because it is declared by ungodly men, then at least accept what Joel says, that the darkness comes before the Day of the Lord.

[The Seven Visions Project @7VisionsProject]

It's nice hearing different perspectives. I'd love to know more about how you come to that view.

I think we may agree on the prelude idea. I would call it an overview, like a trailer to the movie, going from the tribulation to the wrath, but from a Heavenly perspective.

So as each seal is opened we get a glimpse of what is inside, and then once it is fully unrolled we see the effects on earth - the detailed view of the judgments, persecution and wrath.

For that reason, I keep the 7th seal with the other 6 so that it accomplishes the same purpose. It represents the wrath that must follow.

The sealing of the 144,000, and the great multitude are outside that overview timeline, inserted there to show the destiny of two important groups before the details of the tribulation begin.

Is that close to what you mean? Or do you mean the seals are things that happen before the actual tribulation begins?

Can you explain more about how we endure only two woes? Do you mean everything up to the two woes and then we are resurrected at the 3rd woe?