"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - S.Tzu
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers ...fail within the first year. Should they risk their families health and security by forfiting a steady wage for a chance at capital-ownership?
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers A car and a phone in that example are still capital. But besides that, do you realistically expect someone who *has* to work, at risk of deprivation, to suddenly quit their job and put all of their time into tech support? After all, some 90% of small businesses...
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers Huh? In capitalist society, "getting a job and going to the grocery store" means selling my labor to a capitalist in exchange for a wage. That's my point.
Again, just because something was true in the past doesn't mean it should be true now or in the future.
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers 1. When did I mention communism lol?
2. When did I say that people shouldn't have jobs?
3. When did I say that we have the tech to be post-scarcity?
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers ...Either they already have money, i.e. they have access to intergenerational capital, or they're forced to sell their labor to a capitalist for a wage. Your "alternatives" either require a significant amount of capital and are incredibly risky (farming, starting a business)...
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers In order to become like an Amish farmer I'd need the starting capital to buy the land, supplies, tools, agriculture education et.c. On top of that, I'd need savings to support me when my crops inevitably fail at some point. Where do I get that money?
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers At some point down the line, *someone* has to sell their labor to a capitalist. The only alternative is deprivation. I can't reasonably go and live like a yeoman farmer living off of the land because *that also costs money.*
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers 1. Your only realistic choice is to a) already posses capital and use that to hire people to work *for* you, or b) sell your labor to a capitalist. Stop being deliberately obtuse.
2. And how did Amish families come to possess their land?
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers 1. Yes, now you get it. Someone has to either a) own intergenerational capital or b) sell their labor to a capitalist.
2. Yeah being a NEET probably isn't good.
3. Yes, and? Infant mortality used to be 30% in the West. We changed some things and now it isn't.
4. See above.
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers 1. With what starting capital?
2. Exactly, you have to sell your labor to a capitalist.
3. Where did they get the money to take care of you?
4. Where did they get the money to take care of you?
5. Living in the woods is not a realistic alternative to living in society.
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers 1. But NEET's mommy **does** require money to feed and house NEET. Where does that money come from?
2. Sure, maybe.
3. Yes, in class societies you always have to do something to earn the privilege of living.
4. And? Planes weren't built prior to the 20th century, now they are.
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers "Work or starve" means that, in order to acquire the resources you need in order to live (ie food, shelter, transportation, utilities, et.c.) you are forced to sell your labor to a capitalist.
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers Yes you can absolutely afford shelter, food, utilities, education, transportation on a panhandler's income lmao, he said sarcastically
@heysharpshooter@Zenzenzenzen12 @CursedBoomers Lol the vast majority of people living under capitalism don't have access to the intergenerational capital required to live like a NEET. For most people, the choice is clear: work, or starve.