Ryan Matsunaga

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Jfcdoomblade That has to be bait, right? No one sane could possibly measure on a scale from SW to PHM.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons I've got to be honest Lon, the idea that nothing is ethically pure so we should just give up on defending ethics is a really sad place to end up in this discussion, especially coming from someone of your intelligence and eloquence. That makes me feel very bleak about the future.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons Claude was used to plan bombings in Iran. You use Claude, providing money and training data for operations like this to continue. That's a pretty simple critique. You don't have to agree with them, but I think it's a little disingenous to paint it as abstract outrage or paranoia.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons Then I think we circle back to my point that if you participate in these systems, you may be criticized by those that drew an ethical line. If you tweet, "I don't agree with everything they do, but I do donate to the Trump campaign," you can't be shocked when people are upset.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons We agree there, deeper participation can entail more informed opinions. But if that means providing direct support (ie your subscription fees, your training data), that's going to be a hard line for those that see its consequences as ethically untenable. Surely that's reasonable.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons That's such a strange deflection. You are vocal in your criticism of the Trump admin, why wouldn't you join that to know it from the inside? Can you critique others' participation if not? What about a voter, can you critique their support of said org even if they didn't "join"?

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons That feels pretty clear. When critiquing the U.S. military bombing a school, I am not so interested in the nuances of its use of a Tomahawk cruise missile. So we agree that critique of people's funding of Anthropic doesn't require familiarity on which ver of Claude is being used.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons Can you elaborate on why you don't see it as a good analogy? It seems like we agree that participation in the military is not a requirement to be informed enough to critique it, or critique others' participation in its decisions. Why is that a fundamentally different situation?

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons The argument that participation is required to not be ignorant is nonsense. That is like saying if you are not in the Air Force, you can't critique the government's decision to drop a bomb on a grade school. You can be informed about something and against it.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons That's a really strange article to reference. Oracle's own investors think that the company has overspent on AI, so to compensate Oracle is firing tens of thousands of people in order to spend even more. You're arguing that we should support companies like these more?

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons As an example, I can accept that the country I live in is moving towards authoritarianism, that doesn't mean I endorse it. But when I cast a vote for an admin that is pushing that agenda, it seems illogical to now divorce myself from some level of complicity, if not advocacy.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons Surveys conducted by Brookings and others show that a vast majority still do not use AI tools at work on a daily basis, even under a wide definition. This is all moot though. We're discussing whether usage entail endorsement, given the direct impact of money and training data.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons I don't understand how that is connected logic. Why would someone be obligated to try out a product that is directly fueling something that they are drawing a moral line against? We're not discussing utility, but the concrete and immediate consequences that its support entails.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons As I noted, this isn't like playing connect the dots with the MIC and having to engage with society at large. It's a 1-to-1 relationship. Paying both money and time to directly fund these operations. I don't think it's unfair to ask that we at least recognize that as endorsement.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons That's a choice, and given that, I think you have to accept some significant level of complicity. Lots of people can work for a presidential admin without expressly agreeing on all of its policies, but I don't think it's unfair to still label it as a broad level of endorsement.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@Lons

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@millexcel @AidanZuI Source: I made it up

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@NotFifthGear Haas please take notes for Suzuka 2027.

[Ryan Matsunaga @RyanMatsu]

@TimesSqKungFu @TechNTecs You wouldn't count The Villainess/Carter? Jung Doo-hong also had Fist and Furious after City of Violence. Maybe depends on your definition of "pure", but I don't think it's far off from what Ma Dong-seok is doing.