@DrAimeeSmith@CathsAgainstJws I'm fairly sure I'm not going to change your mind. But you can actually just read the recent encylical for an easy example. Leo talks about how both slavery and lack of religious freedom were approved in the past by the Church but then we came to better appreciate human dignity
@theoscholastica Well, i think there were a lot of good developments in doctrine since those ones. So I mostly just like it for that reason, correcting past errors
@OrthodoxOrigen I've read his late views though, like his letter to simplicanus, and he's basically just saying we're all a damned mass, and God just gives some of us unmerited grace and gives the rest merited justice (damnation) by not giving us the needed grace. Seems like Calvin to me.
@DrAimeeSmith@CathsAgainstJws I know about that document. It's not some official Catholic view. If you want to know the official view, read Nostra Aetate. Vatican has apologized for much of its past misguided approaches on things like religious freedom, torture, inquisitions, burning at the state, slavery etc
@OrthodoxOrigen And to be clear, I think their view is abhorrent. But it seems clear that late Augustine's views during the Pelagian controversy pivoted from the earlier consensus and led to Thomism/Calvinism etc. Thank God the Church never dogmatized that view
@OrthodoxOrigen Many Thomists & other Augustinians disagree. To me, the key question is, does God REALLY will all to be saved or does he reprobate some (most?) before considering their merits or demerits & withhold certain graces? I read Thomas/Augustine/Calvin/Luther as saying the latter
@OrthodoxWario Well, I think he finds real sources that back up what he's saying. The problem is there are also sources saying the opposite. It's trad cafeteria Catholicism where you just ignore the modern magisterium and go with your pick of old non-definitive statements that you prefer.
@BTweeter87 Rome's document on this basically said limbo is no longer preferred theological position. Now we hope for all their salvation & we have good reason since God wants to save them and isn't limited by the sacraments. That's our developed position now since Vatican approved document
@OrthodoxWario Canon Law says explicitly, "No doctrine is understood as defined infallibly unless this is manifestly evident." So guys like that (& Christian Wagner) who just declare things dogmas because it's been said by popes before are just wrong. Curious how Orthodox settle disputes now
@MeghanEMurphy The issue is people don't talk about their needs, I think. Men don't really need sex to be a big performance or soul-connecting romantic experience. It's something nature makes almost like eating or sleeping for us -- a very strong predictable drive that just needs... addressing
@MeghanEMurphy Okay, but they should just be fully aware that, from the man's perspective, that's the day the relationship dies and she become a roommate.