@nas19ua@taj1944 I would've either traded demko or let him walk. Bring up tolipiolo and run that tandem. I think I saw a stat saying demko has played in 38% of the possible games over the last 3 years...
@Iamcanadianeh@mrsunshinebaby Ive said this since this whole thing has started.
The USA has a history of destabilizing governments through their military and CIA. So to gain access to our oil. Don't you think its plausible that they could be doing the same thing under Trump here in Canada?
If Alberta actually left Canada (hypothetically speaking, no military, no federal healthcare funding, having to build all national institutions from scratch), it’d be a total mess in my opinion. Sure, the separatists talk a big game about keeping all that oil money, but the cons stack up way higher than the pros. Here’s why I think it’d tank their prosperity short-term and maybe long-term too—speaking as someone from Toronto who’s seen enough provincial beef.
First off, the landlocked issue is a killer. Alberta’s got no ocean access, so all those oil exports via pipelines? They’d have to cross new international borders through BC, Saskatchewan, or down to the US. That means potential tariffs, tolls, extra fees, and endless negotiations. Economists I’ve read estimate non-tariff barriers could add 4-8% costs, shrinking the economy by 4-6% overall—that’s like $20-30 billion a year gone, or $3,900-6,000 per person. Trade with the rest of Canada (their biggest partner) turns into a bureaucratic nightmare, kinda like Brexit but for a province-sized economy. No more seamless access to ports or markets.
Then there’s losing all the federal supports and shared costs. Alberta’s a net contributor, yeah, but they still get billions back in stuff like healthcare transfers—around $6-7 billion a year vanishes overnight. They’d have to fully fund their own universal healthcare system without any fed help, plus build everything else: a military or defense setup (super expensive, maybe outsource to the US or go neutral, but good luck staying safe), border controls, customs agencies, a new currency and central bank, diplomacy offices, UN membership, and renegotiating trade deals like CUSMA. As a tiny new country, they’d have zero leverage against giants like Canada or the US. Shared infrastructure? Gone—highways, rail, all that gets divvied up in messy divorce talks.
The transition itself would be chaotic as hell. Just the uncertainty during separation negotiations could cause massive capital flight—investors pulling out, businesses relocating head offices to Vancouver or Toronto (we’d love that here in ON), and people moving away if jobs dry up. The tax base erodes quick, making those rosy surplus projections fall apart. And don’t get me started on post-oil cleanup: hundreds of billions in abandoned wells and environmental liabilities, all on Alberta’s dime now, no federal bailout.
Finally, that heavy oil dependency is a huge vulnerability. Without federal regs or pipeline delays, maybe they ramp up production, but global prices are volatile AF. One energy transition or demand drop (hello, EVs and renewables), and revenues crash with no big federation to cushion it. Diversification? Easier said than done when you’re starting from scratch as a small nation.
Bottom line: Alberta’s got killer starting GDP per capita from resources, but these hits would likely cause economic contraction, short/medium-term pain, and overall poorer outcomes. Staying in Canada gives stability, market access, and shared risks that outweigh the “we pay more than we get” complaints. What do you think, Alberta folks? Am I missing something?
If Alberta actually left Canada (hypothetically speaking, no military, no federal healthcare funding, having to build all national institutions from scratch), it’d be a total mess in my opinion. Sure, the separatists talk a big game about keeping all that oil money, but the cons stack up way higher than the pros. Here’s why I think it’d tank their prosperity short-term and maybe long-term too—speaking as someone from Toronto who’s seen enough provincial beef.
First off, the landlocked issue is a killer. Alberta’s got no ocean access, so all those oil exports via pipelines? They’d have to cross new international borders through BC, Saskatchewan, or down to the US. That means potential tariffs, tolls, extra fees, and endless negotiations. Economists I’ve read estimate non-tariff barriers could add 4-8% costs, shrinking the economy by 4-6% overall—that’s like $20-30 billion a year gone, or $3,900-6,000 per person. Trade with the rest of Canada (their biggest partner) turns into a bureaucratic nightmare, kinda like Brexit but for a province-sized economy. No more seamless access to ports or markets.
Then there’s losing all the federal supports and shared costs. Alberta’s a net contributor, yeah, but they still get billions back in stuff like healthcare transfers—around $6-7 billion a year vanishes overnight. They’d have to fully fund their own universal healthcare system without any fed help, plus build everything else: a military or defense setup (super expensive, maybe outsource to the US or go neutral, but good luck staying safe), border controls, customs agencies, a new currency and central bank, diplomacy offices, UN membership, and renegotiating trade deals like CUSMA. As a tiny new country, they’d have zero leverage against giants like Canada or the US. Shared infrastructure? Gone—highways, rail, all that gets divvied up in messy divorce talks.
The transition itself would be chaotic as hell. Just the uncertainty during separation negotiations could cause massive capital flight—investors pulling out, businesses relocating head offices to Vancouver or Toronto (we’d love that here in ON), and people moving away if jobs dry up. The tax base erodes quick, making those rosy surplus projections fall apart. And don’t get me started on post-oil cleanup: hundreds of billions in abandoned wells and environmental liabilities, all on Alberta’s dime now, no federal bailout.
Finally, that heavy oil dependency is a huge vulnerability. Without federal regs or pipeline delays, maybe they ramp up production, but global prices are volatile AF. One energy transition or demand drop (hello, EVs and renewables), and revenues crash with no big federation to cushion it. Diversification? Easier said than done when you’re starting from scratch as a small nation.
Bottom line: Alberta’s got killer starting GDP per capita from resources, but these hits would likely cause economic contraction, short/medium-term pain, and overall poorer outcomes. Staying in Canada gives stability, market access, and shared risks that outweigh the “we pay more than we get” complaints. What do you think, Alberta folks? Am I missing something?