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@michaeloburns True, I just feel you offer so much information and have helped me form better opinions throughout the years so I feel it would be cool to see you guys just talk ever about nothing serious. but your right there is no point to going on, just something I would love :)
You list every tragedy in China’s early revolutionary history as if they were unique, unprecedented, and unforgivable.
Fine.
Let us accept your framing for a moment.
Now look at the world through the same lens.
If human suffering discredits a government, America should not just collapse. It should be removed from history altogether.
You talk about "state-engineered famine."
What do you think happened to the Indigenous nations of the Americas?
Those weren’t crop failures.
They were deliberate extermination policies, forced removals, biological warfare, and starvation campaigns written into law.
Hundreds of nations erased.
Entire civilizations consumed.
A hemisphere depopulated, devastated, and carved open for a single rising empire.
You talk about the "CCP destroying cultural heritage."
What do you think the United States did to the Cherokee, the Lakota, the Navajo, the Cheyenne, the Apache, the Seminole, the Modoc, the Yuroc, the Haudenosaunee?
What did the boarding schools do?
What did forced assimilation do?
What did missionaries do?
That wasn’t "cultural loss."
That was annihilation.
You talk about "political purges."
America turned that into a global franchise.
Iran 1953.
Guatemala 1954.
Congo 1961.
Indonesia 1965 with one million dead.
Chile 1973.
Korea. Vietnam. Laos. Cambodia. El Salvador. Nicaragua. Grenada. Haiti. Yugoslavia. Iraq. Libya. Syria. Somalia. Yemen. Sudan. Afghanistan. Ukraine.
A list so long it leaves China’s internal tragedies looking like footnotes in comparison.
If numbers are your metric, then America is the most lethal political project in human history.
No ideology in the 20th century killed more people than American foreign policy.
Not Mao.
Not Stalin.
Not anyone.
And while you’re counting deaths, don’t forget the part Americans themselves pretend never happened:
The United States did not need a revolution to kill millions.
It did it through capitalism itself during the Great Depression, when a "civilized" market system let a quarter of the population starve, freeze, and live in shantytowns while food was burned to keep prices high.
If China’s early turmoil invalidates China, why does America’s collapse not invalidate America?
You talk about "authoritarianism."
Tell that to the families napalmed in Vietnam.
Tell that to the children starved by sanctions in Iraq.
Tell that to every government replaced by a CIA asset.
Tell that to every country whose elections were overthrown because the outcome displeased Washington.
You accuse China of "European-imported ideology."
But America itself is the continuation of European empire on stolen land.
A settler colony with European laws, European institutions, European racial hierarchies, and European political culture.
China didn’t erase its civilization.
It restored its sovereignty after a century of Western occupation, opium wars, unequal treaties, and carved-up concessions.
You sneer at China’s "hybrid economy."
Yet it lifted 800 million people out of poverty,
Built the world’s largest infrastructure network,
Eradicated absolute poverty,
And became the engine of global growth without invading or destroying other nations.
Meanwhile, the United States built the world’s largest prison system,
Collapsed its industrial base and its public health,
Manufactured consent through fear,
And plunged its population into debt, addiction, homelessness, and despair while spending trillions on wars it lost.
So let us be clear.
If you want to judge nations by suffering, America loses by every measure.
If you want to judge them by outcomes, China wins by every measure.
China builds.
America destroys.
History is not confused about which is which.
Dean, you did not present a moral argument.
You presented a selective list of suffering stripped of context, scale, and causation.
The moment you apply your standard universally, your entire worldview collapses.
Because your real problem is simple:
China stands where the West once stood.
And it did so without slaughtering the world to get there.
That is what you cannot forgive.
@HamNCheddar Yea I'm with you on this one comments even under just that post are hellish these people will hunt down other humans for creating a video game
@DewDeeDa@LolOverruled God we need something. Those bank freaks came to “inspect” the property. If I was at the hospital and my dad wasn’t home they would have tried to lock us out. I’m terrified. I got like two days left.