@BobbyBarnard4@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE ive already explained how your ridiculous semantic argument is pointless. if the right to due process is conditional then it is not a right and can be denied to you at any time. you are arguing for tyranny that you just hope will only be used against people who arent you
@BobbyBarnard4@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE it doesnt even matter that you dont understand what "independent" means. if some people can be denied due process, then ANY person can be denied due process. if you get arrested and denied due process, then your status as a citizen is irrelevant because you cant prove it. get it?
@BobbyBarnard4@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE the constitution is written with very specific language. there is no reason for them to not reuse the word "citizen" if they meant "citizen." the semicolon seperates two independent clauses, one refering to "citizens" and one refering to "persons" because they are not the same
@TheAptCatalyst@BobbyBarnard4@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE my point was never that illegal immigration isnt a crime, my point was that you have to prove someone is an illegal immigrant before you can snatch them off the street and ship them off. if ICE is allowed to grab anyone and imprison them without due process, then noone is safe
@BobbyBarnard4@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE why wouldnt they specify "citizens" if they meant citizens? they use the word in one part of the sentence, then they use a different word later. "citizens" and "persons" are not interchangable unless previously specified
@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE so those people are sheep for giving in to a fearmongering campaign, but you arent for actually believing that 20 million people have invaded the country and are raping and pillaging while somehow getting free healthcare and housing. that sounds way more realistic than a pandemic
@BobbyBarnard4@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE "any person"
it doesnt specify citizens, because it cannot be applied conditionally without invalidating itself. if you were denied due process you wouldnt get the chance to prove your citizenship
@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE incredible, you were sold the exact same lie that every authoritarian regime uses to take rights away and you bought it hook line and sinker. "we're only going after enemies of the state! nothing to hide nothing to fear!"
ill bet you called a lot of people "sheep" during covid
@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE i didnt like it under obama, biden, or trump, i am not a democrat, but again youre ignoring the point. if you don't think armed soldiers patrolling in unmarked cars grabbing people off the streets and demanding to see your papers isnt tyranny then what is?
@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE if you werent so caught up in your bizarre fantasies about immigrant rapists and social services that we dont even get, youd understand im talking about the rights of citizens being violated by law enforcement, the very tyranny the Right loves to pretend to fight against
@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE what you dont understand is that if only citizens have rights, and ICE doesnt know a citizen from a non citizen until they see proof, then ICE is free to illegally arrest and search anyone they please, including you, until you prove youre a citizen
@TheAptCatalyst@David_J_Bier@GlennWarrenPE so say ICE grabs an american citizen (which theyve done plenty of times) and, assuming theyre a non-citizen, denies them due process (which again is unconstitutional), how does that citizen get to prove theyre being wrongfully detained?