Donskoy

Defender of Faith and Reason

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@Bibigo61 @monty13182 @fawzydawah Interpreting Al-Zutt in this way is nonsensical in terms of linguistics, historical context & theology
Obviously the same goes for the nonsense about Jesus & Paul
There's way more interesting things to debate
We should use critical thinking without being intellectually dishonest

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @Bibigo61 @fawzydawah I'm criticizing both

There's other ways to dismantle such weak and false arguments made in bad faith
We all fail, we all can do better

May both of you find peace and may God lead us All to more wisdom, knowledge, humility and love

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @Bibigo61 @fawzydawah Both
Al-Zutt and this nonsense are bad faith arguments at best
There's no serious scholar interpreting either one of them this way
Mocking the torture Jesus subjected himself to, even if you don't believe in the Trinity, is a really bad look

Both should be intellectually honest

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@kuzanite @IslamicApex The argument is that mohamed is seen by a majority of Muslims as a eternal and perfect moral example..

What's your pov on this?

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@adris680 @IslamicApex Al-Bukhari
Aysha herself
Mohamed married her at 6 and "consummated" the marriage when she was 9

Because a 9 year old can't give consent
And his Concubines also couldn't...

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@MBreshearsArt @Maximumatheist Sorry
I didn't see this before answering to the other reply of yours

That's perfectly alright with me

Thank you very much for this exchange

And may God Bless you and your loved ones with a long and healthy Life

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@MBreshearsArt @Maximumatheist It's one way to point to his existence
There's also other reasons to believe

All in all, it seems at least like a plausible explanation
If you like to deep dive into Christian Theology, we can ofc

We can discuss the historical vs theological person of Jesus and the Trinity...

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@KeyeZio @IslamicApex Ok
If you want to go there
Let God be my Judge
I tried

Do you believe that mohamed was "the best man who ever walked this earth" outside of time and historical context?
If so
Why sex slaves?
Why Aysha (6/9)
Why murder the tribe of Banu Qurayza after they surrendered?

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@maneshark @Maximumatheist There's a long and in my opinion interesting exchange i had under this post on this topic
In short

If universe = time, space, mass
Something outside of these parameters had to be the reason for its creation
U=t,s,m
G≠U

Meaning God is atemporal, aspatial, and non-material.

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@MBreshearsArt @Maximumatheist There might be value in a higher moral guidance than Subjectivism
+
Spiritual fulfillment and deeply loving humility

But OK, I respect your perspective and want to thank you for this exchange and respectful behavior

May God, believe in him or not, Bless you and your loved ones

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@KeyeZio @IslamicApex I don't see the Irony
But I just had a surprisingly great and respectful debate with a muslim and I don't want to ruin this
So
Let's leave it at that

May God guide you and Bless you and Your Family with a long and Healthy Life

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah Hmm
Here i don't really agree
Yes, Jesus lived in a historical period with it's own context but the Life he lived and morals he teached are timeless, and we don't have every single word he preached
Silence in Text isn't approval
But let's leave it at a respectful disagreement
TC

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah Thanks for the clarification!
I can respect that

Thank you
And take care

May God Bless you and your loved ones with a long and healthy life

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@MBreshearsArt @Maximumatheist Ok,but maybe this process / different physical state would just be God..?

But to summarize and paraphrase your point to see if I understand

Different concepts with equal value
But we as humans are not, maybe yet maybe never, capable of knowing for sure..?

I can respect that

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah Oh man

The last reply of yours was so good
It's sad that's you had to follow it up with this
Man
Why?

Either it's ETERNAL or it's just understandable in a historical context
Two completely different things...

Jesus is still perfect, without historical context

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah Great point!

I doubt that a majority of Muslims would agree
Atleast most i met and discussed with were pretty strict that mohamed is a perfect moral guide for all time and humanity

But I can respect that
Thank you

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@MBreshearsArt @Maximumatheist Ok
Thanks for your honesty
Orthodox Christianity absolutely believes in Mysteries without trying to define every detail

The "I don't know" is good, believing in mysteries great..

Would you agree that there atleast a possibility that the beginning wasn't random but deliberate?

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah Amalekites show up multiple times afterwards
So clearly this didn't happen but was meant as a hyperbolic command

Jesus,by becoming flesh, brought forth the new Covenant
Christians aren't bound by Mosaic Law and Jesus went to Hades to save their souls afterwards

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah Yes
Historically correct
But not compatible with an everlasting moral virtue

"She" wasn't the only one, mohamed had a multitude of Concubines

And yes, again, in his time and for their understanding of War understandable and fine
But he is supposedly the best man forever...

[Donskoy @NevskyDialectic]

@monty13182 @fawzydawah That the point
Muslims, the absolute majority atleast, believe that mohamed was a perfect man
With perfect moral values
Outside of historical context

Either he was just a human doing things considered normal at his time
Or he was chosen to be a moral guide forever