I often half-jokingly tell people that Moshfegh's MYORAR made me reconsider my stance on book burning. Works of art absolutely can (and do) poison culture, and "Amoral art" is always an implicit endorsement of prevailing norms, even if it arrives wearing a scandalous outfit
@ZakSmithSabbath Fully disagree with A. Re: B, I make no claims regarding secondary effects or predictions; these are related but distinct Qs. C is again relative: a sandwich could be "good" (to me) because I'm hungry, and I value being not hungry. But a celiac might find the bread "subversive".
@ZakSmithSabbath Well the conversation's really moved away from the original point of discussion, obviously, and a lot more claims have been made. I'm not sure I've been proven wrong. The sandwich was your example of something seemingly "amoral," that actually was loaded with moral assumptions
@ZakSmithSabbath 4. Yes, I think this is correct. A thing I view as "bad" is worse if it's broadcast to millions over mass media than if it's collecting dust in some closet. Which was my point about Moshfegh's MYORAR. It was, to me, morally questionable, AND also published and marketed superbly
@ZakSmithSabbath 2. If I go out and hold up a sign that says something ridiculous like "round surfaces are evil," that's a moral case being proposed, regardless of whether anyone listens
3. Agreed, interpretation is its own act. But the interpretation sorta relies on the thing being interpreted
@ZakSmithSabbath 4. I don't think so, because if you're making art, you likely think the way you're moralizing is "good." I don't argue all of this with a stone-chiseled moral hierarchy in mind, but a relativist conception of it. That judgment about suicide would require its own hierarchy to work
@ZakSmithSabbath 2. I'd argue impactfulness is more a measure of quality and exposure, though you're right the viewer has a hand in the morality of a piece. People can be confronted with moralized objects and not feel impacted. It doesn't reduce the object's moralization, just its "effectiveness"
@ZakSmithSabbath 1. Left another reply about the moral implications of sandwich-making
2. It's not about impact but about what the art imposes on (or proposes to) the receiver--which might only be the artist themself. We self-propagandize frequently
3. You're Correct. Death of the sandwich artist
@ZakSmithSabbath Actually, a sandwich could be a moralized object. Where do the ingredients/labor come from? What is the history of "the sandwich"? Do you expect others to find it appealing? Why should you eat it rather than someone else? Even in this simple creative act, you've condoned so much!
@ZakSmithSabbath I believe an artwork is inextricable from its artist and the cultural/moral context they exist within. Amorality is an impossibility because the prevailing norm is by definition an assumption of that context. To not oppose it is to leave it unopposed. Inaction is a meaningful act
@pourfairelevide@maxdaniellawton In one case, an authority removes content from the cultural consciousness. In the other, an authority never lets it enter in the first place. In either case, someone's making that decision with all their biases. I think that's worth considering when talking about art and morality
The quote is contradictory in many ways, but not even Moshfegh's own work survives the scrutiny. MYORAR clearly has a moral system and "afternoon special" takeaways. She constructed a hierarchy, and PRH published it. It's got excellent writing, but we can't pretend it's agnostic
@BeckyLTuch Have you heard anything about @Gulf_Coast? They sent rejections for their "2025 Prize in Fiction" back in July, stating winners were posted online, yet no winners are posted, and they were still taking entries for another contest (at $20 a pop) just a month ago.
@TheLincoln The ongoing proliferation of "tech" is largely inertial cargo-culting, a belief that because sophisticated systems utilize more screens, utilizing more screens will produce a sophisticated system.
Maybe elites stand to lose materially and so abandon this religious thinking first