George (GGeorge4IV)

Imperfect old soul. God ✝️, Family ❤️, Country 🇺🇲. Can enjoy arguments, but not bickering. Like odd humor & sarcasm.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Do you think God is the author of confusion, a liar, or James introduction shows that his letter explicitly was not to us?

James 1:1 to 12 tribes
Romans 1:7 to saints

But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness
Romans 4:5 KJB #scripture

James, to tribulation saints, faith + works

Paul, all letters to saints (church age), faith without works.

Bro, slowly read and study Galations. The book repeatedly reminds us that works has nothing to do with Justification (getting saved)

Now, of course we SHOULD do good works (Ephesians 2:10), but NOWHERE in Paul's letters does he say we MUST do good works for salvation/justification.

Our good works will be for our rewards when we get to the judgement seat of Christ. Having been saved by faith alone gets us to the judgement seat of Christ.

If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

2 Timothy 2:13 KJB #scripture

Because we are sealed until the day of redemption (Ephesians 1:13-14).

🤔

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Okay, you're continuing to assert the conclusion rather than demonstrating it from the passage.

Paul specifically says "sabbath days" and then says they are a shadow of things to come. You can't simply redefine "sabbath days" as something other than God's Sabbath because you believe God's Sabbath must continue.

And that's really the issue we've been discussing: not whether God gave Israel the Sabbath (as a sign to Israel/not us). He did. Not whether it was part of God's law. It was. The question is whether the Body of Christ is under that covenant and commandment today.

Paul says:

Let no man therefore judge you ... of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Colossians 2:16-17 KJB #Scripture

That's a pretty difficult verse to get around if the claim is that Christians are required to keep the seventh-day Sabbath.

If you're going to continue repeating denominational doctrine rather than demonstrating it from Scripture concerning the Body of Christ, I'll stop engaging. I'm interested in what the Scriptures say, not what a denomination tells us they must mean.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

I'm not clear how you associate RCC "system" into this? I see assembly of believers as church all over Paul's letters (as well as other NT books).

When I try to find what's referred to as RCC system I find:

The hierarchy - pope, cardinals, bishops, priests, etc.

Church authority - the claim that the Church and its teaching authority have binding authority over doctrine.

Sacramental system - baptism, Eucharist, confession, confirmation, marriage, ordination, anointing of the sick, etc.

Tradition and magisterium - Catholic tradition and the Church's teaching office alongside Scripture.

Doctrinal framework - doctrines such as justification, Mary, purgatory, indulgences, transubstantiation, apostolic succession, and so forth.
Canon law and institutional structure - the rules and organizational machinery governing the Church.

The claim of institutional continuity - particularly the claim that the RCC is the historical Church established by Christ and that the pope possesses a unique Petrine authority.

I hope/assume by now you have seen that I have replied to those advocati g them with verses showing their errors on how they approach much/most of this. That doesn't mean that they are wrong with everything. Ex, I disagree with crusifix, but that does not mean Jesus did not die on the cross, right?

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

That's a pretty poor choice of a false dichotomy: "you're either Israel or a heathen." It would be worth studying what Paul means by rightly dividing the word of truth before making Israel's promises and commandments automatically applicable to the Body of Christ.

Romans 2:29 doesn't say every Gentile believer becomes Israel. Paul is explaining what constitutes a true Jew in the context of his argument about Israel. And Paul later makes a clear distinction:

Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:
1 Corinthians 10:32 KJB #Scripture

Paul even identifies himself as the apostle of the Gentiles:

For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
Romans 11:13 KJB #Scripture

So the question remains: what did Paul tell the Body of Christ concerning the Sabbath?

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Colossians 2:16-17 KJB #Scripture

And regarding your Revelation 14 meme: Revelation concerns Israel's prophetic program and the Tribulation, not doctrine given to the Body of Christ. You can't use a Tribulation passage to override Paul's doctrine for the church.

Rightly divide the Scriptures, and the contradiction disappears.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

@GuyJackson777 @MarianTheosis @BigfootMilitia * to have joy in 🤓 😃

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Isaiah 56 and Isaiah 66 are speaking within Israel's prophetic program and the future kingdom, not giving doctrine to the Body of Christ.

But you're assuming the Sabbath in Colossians 2 cannot refer to the fourth commandment simply because Paul doesn't write the words "Ten Commandments." Read and pray upon what the text itself says:

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Colossians 2:16-17 KJB #Scripture

Paul specifically includes sabbath days among the things that are a shadow and says not to let anyone judge you concerning them.

And the Sabbath wasn't merely a generic Mosaic ritual. God explicitly called it a sign between Himself and Israel:

Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever:
Exodus 31:16-17 KJB #Scripture

That's Israel. The question isn't whether Israel had a Sabbath covenant. They did. The question is whether the Body of Christ is under that covenant today.

Paul's answer is that we are not to be judged concerning Sabbath days, because they were a shadow and Christ is the body/reality.

Isaiah 56 and 66 don't override Paul's doctrine for the Body of Christ any more than Israel's circumcision covenant becomes our commandment because it is called everlasting.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

@BrackFrank @NCMan13 @YourCalvinist While I would tighten up a phrase a bit for symantic sake, we concur 100% on that last sentance.
🙏 You and your discussion

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

he Sabbath was a sign to Israel. It involved ceasing from work, including requiring servants and others to rest, and it was connected with Israel's sacrificial system.

It was done away with at the cross.

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Colossians 2:13-14 KJB #Scripture

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: And the next verse explains what those things were:
Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Colossians 2:16-17 KJB #Scripture

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Yes, with an important distinction.

For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
Romans 10:4 KJB #Scripture

In context, "for righteousness" is the key. Christ is the end of the law as a means of obtaining righteousness before God. We are justified by faith in Christ, not by keeping the law.

But that does not mean the believer has no standard of conduct or that obedience has no relevance to sanctification and rewards.

Paul makes the distinction clear:

Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Romans 3:31 KJB #Scripture

And, we believer's do face a future judgment:

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
2 Corinthians 5:10 KJB #Scripture

Christ is the end of the law for justification, not the end of godly obedience in the Christian life. The law cannot justify us, but Paul still teaches that our works matter for sanctification, service, and rewards at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Now, that's complicated, no? Each individual had to give their reason to God and those reason(s) will overlap and not all be the same with anothers.

The Pharisees' failure as a while to recognize Christ wasn't simply because Scripture couldn't be understood. Scripture gives us several reasons, including unbelief, pride, seeking the praise of men, and hardness of heart.

Having theological or academic knowledge doesn't guarantee that someone will believe or obey what the Scriptures say. That's actually part of the warning of Scripture itself.

And that's precisely why our doctrine must come from God's Word rather than from an institution, denomination, tradition, or theological authority of man. Men can be wrong, and institutions can be wrong. God's Word is the authority by which we are to examine what men teach.

So I don't think the Pharisees are an argument against studying and understanding Scripture. If anything, they demonstrate why we must approach God's Word honestly and be willing to believe what it actually says, rather than relying on an authority simply because it has theological credentials.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

I may have missed your point, fair.

My reply was in context of someone asking about losing your salvation during the church age. Which cannot happen once you are saved. Period.

I've found that people generally will either justify based on equating someone else's sin(s) as being so much more grievous than their own (self-righteous), or as in this case, owning verses that do not apply to the Bride of Christ (not rightly dividing).

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

That's not an excuse to teach against clear biblical doctrine. Scripture was given to be studied, understood, and rightly divided. If something is unclear, we should search the Scriptures rather than use "it's not given to everyone to understand" as a defense for an interpretation that contradicts clear doctrine.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Mark 3:28-29 is not doctrine given to the Body of Christ. Christ was speaking to Israel during His earthly ministry, warning them about blaspheming the Holy Ghost. Nothing Paul teaches concerning the Body of Christ matches this.

It's the same as quoting "faith without works is dead" from James, whose epistle is addressed to the twelve tribes (James 1:1).

Where does Paul ever say that a member of the Body of Christ can lose the Holy Spirit's seal or eternal salvation?

[Wall Street Apes @WallStreetApes]

America has normalized Treason to the point where people running for Governor openly pledge allegiance to foreign 3rd worlders over Americans

Amy Klobucher is funded by George Soros, she’s taken money from:

- Alexander Soros
- Jonathan Soros
- Open Society Foundation, George Soros’ nonprofit

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

Ignorance/rejection of scripture and/or rebellion towards God.

[Doog @doogadoo11]

Anyone care to explain all the Israel/Jew hate to me?

Otherwise, I'll just assume people’s minds have been captured by Qatar and Iran

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

@doogadoo11 Ignorance/rejection of scripture and/or rebellion towards God.

[Matt Van Swol @mattvanswol]

I would just like to point out that I have never once seen a large mob of Amish "teens" beating police officers, vandalizing businesses, or lighting cars on fire.

Not once.

In the entire history of the internet.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

@Vincent_Writes As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:
1 Peter 2:2 KJV #Scripture

Thank God for his pure and perfect sincere word!

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

You're still assuming that castaway means losing salvation, but 1 Corinthians 9:24-27 never says that. Paul's immediate subject is running for a prize and being a castaway in the context of his ministry and service. The next chapter uses Israel as an example of believers being judged for their conduct. That establishes consequences for disobedience, not loss of eternal life.

Israel being overthrown in the wilderness actually illustrates the distinction. They were God's people, yet many suffered God's temporal judgment because of disobedience. Paul then applies that warning to Christian conduct. It doesn't say that a member of the Body of Christ becomes unsealed or ceases to belong to Christ.

Free will isn't the issue. I absolutely believe a saved person can freely choose to disobey, fail, suffer consequences, lose reward, and be ashamed at the Judgment Seat of Christ. What I don't see is a Pauline passage teaching that a believer who has been sealed with the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption can become unsealed and lose eternal life.

If castaway means loss of salvation here, then show where Paul says that the "prize" is eternal life, or where he says being castaway means becoming unsaved. The text itself doesn't say either.

[George (GGeorge4IV) @ggeorge4iv]

1 Corinthians 9:27 does not say Paul feared losing his salvation. The context is running for the prize and being a castaway, immediately followed by Israel being given as examples concerning conduct and consequences. That fits the Judgment Seat of Christ and loss of reward, not the loss of eternal life.

The issue is whether God's work of sealing us can ultimately fail. Scripture says He cannot deny Himself abd he is the head of the body of Christ in whom the saved are members.

The warnings to believers are real, but they do not mean loss of salvation. One need to distinguish warnings concerning our service, conduct, and reward at the Judgment Seat of Christ from the security of the believer's position in Christ.